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Questions regarding the Roland V-1600 HD mixer

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by fryup, Apr 27, 2012.

  1. fryup

    fryup Mike/The Midi Thief

    I'm considering renting a Roland V-1600 HD mixer for an event.
    I want to make a vintage filter ontop of a live broadcast (comming in over HDMI).

    1. Would a filter with a color gradient even work to compose with the live broadcast using chroma/luma key in the mixer? (I never tired)

    2. Has anyone used the option with a still image layer in DSK-mode? Will the V-1600 honor the alpha channel in a BMP-file? That could be an easy solution to making that filter.
  2. sleepytom

    sleepytom VJF Admin

    can you explain a bit more about what your sources are and where they are coming from?
  3. fryup

    fryup Mike/The Midi Thief

    Yes, a live TV cast coming in over HDMI to the mixer from a digital tv box. The filter would be an Instagram style vintage effect (a color gradient) as video or still image.

    I've been thinking this through a bit more and it seems like what I need is to be able to change the the color values of the TV source (possible in the mixer) and blend the effect layer with the TV source. The latter is probably not possible since the mixer doesn't have and blend modes. Does any HD mixer have blend modes btw? I think the Vixid's mixer has it but it's SD only.

    So anyhow - probably no to question 1 then.

    As for question nr 2. On the V-1600 HD it's possible to add a BMP file from a USB Flash memory as a layer on top of the mix. My idea was that if the mixer honors the alpha channel in the BMP file it was going to be possible to create something similar to the blend mode "multiply". But I think I've got that idea wrong anyway. But the idea was nice, it would have been practical to be able to add a graphic filter from a USB stick.
  4. sleepytom

    sleepytom VJF Admin

    You might well find the digi box will not output into a mixer due to HDCP limitations.

    I would suggest it will be cheaper and easier to do this effects setup using a windows computer with a digital tv card inside. With the correct card you should be able to simply use the live tv source inside a vj software and add whatever effects you like.
  5. fryup

    fryup Mike/The Midi Thief

    Ok, thanks I will look into that.
  6. fryup

    fryup Mike/The Midi Thief

    Ok, so I looked into the HDCP thing a bit, and that will most likely be a problem as you say.

    But won't the HDCP problem be the same for the digital TV-cards? And how will the VJ programs make use of the TV source from the cards? I will not build a windows machine myself but I'm very interested to hear if you have any recommendations on cards and VJ softwares on Windows that will do this?

    With the HDCP problem in mind I also found another possible solution: converting the digital signal to analog and it will shake the HDCP problem. And since I'm adding a vintage effect I'm dumbing down the image and I might as well go analog. Then I can use a Vixid mixer that has blend modes. But I don't know how many Vxid mixers there are for rent in my area.
  7. alfaleader

    alfaleader Member

    HDCP is a technique against piracy. If one of the devices in the chain doesn't support hdcp (monitor, projector, bluray player...) it won't play.

    Converting to analog would "remove" the hdcp and the copy protection, so this isn't possible.

    There is a device called the HDfury that removes hdcp but it's a little bit illegal.
  8. fryup

    fryup Mike/The Midi Thief

    True, the device that I've been looking at (there's a HDMI>Component and HDMI>VGA http://www.digitaltvexperten.se/produkt.php?p=2959) does exactly that, remove the HDCP.

    The legality of the whole thing is questionable, I agree. But the client is paying for broadcasting the live TV show to an audience. But they want to style the broadcast their way. They also want to swap out the commercial breaks for their own. The legality of the latter is probably even more questionable. The client is however the main sponsor of the show. Then again I don't see this ever going to be approved if going through the proper channel. Oh what the event agencies sometimes gets away with...
  9. fryup

    fryup Mike/The Midi Thief

    And the question remains regarding Windows machine + TV card and HDCP. So the TV card would honor the HDCP but a VJ program would still somehow be able to gain access to the video feed? Screen grab or how would this happen technically?
  10. sleepytom

    sleepytom VJF Admin

    Sounds like a high budget project.

    There are loads of ways you could / can do it actually. But your missing many obvious ones. Time to hire an expert?
  11. fryup

    fryup Mike/The Midi Thief

    No sound like an event agency trying to pull off something creative and manageable at a not too high cost. And yes, I might advice them to hire someone else to set it up or just advice against it.

    Personally I just don't like that it takes a lot of technology to create an outcome that feel rather simple to the viewer. A lot of money for for very little.
  12. sleepytom

    sleepytom VJF Admin

    It doesn't take a lot of expensive kit to do this. It takes knowledge and experiance. I could buy everything you need to pull it off for less than £1000.

    It's really simple. Capture yuv output from digibox into Vj app. Add correct filters to give the look they want. Output to projector or whatever.

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